For now, I think we are gong to have to do that. I have it as a project to think about at 70 since we are losing Convoke.
you gonna update this soon?
Yes not 70 yet though, only 66. Though I have been playing around with it to see what works and what doesn’t work.
Apex Pred for example which is a Max FB with no energy cost or combo points is a very powerful spell that works in conjunction with rip. This is going to be a must-have talent at 70.
The other talent that is going to be a must-have is Circle of Life and Death which speeds up your dots by 25%. This is incredibly powerful and will give you about a 20% DPS boost. The only issue with it, is many of your dots tend to fall off because they are going so much faster. If this talent is being used, the rotation I imagine will need to be changed to match the speed of this.
This looks like the build I’m going to focus on. It’s Bee’s talent spec that has the most synergy, as I said the rotation will have to slightly be changed to match the speed of the dots.
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Hi All
I finally hit 70 today, and honestly, I wasn’t very happy with my DPS compared to what I see with other classes.
There is something wrong with Kitty Druids, and it’s more than likely from balance tuning done in these weekly cycles. Back at level 60, it was worth skipping FB and going full Primal Wrath, and the DPS would be stellar. Now at 70, Primal Wrath does excellent damage, but really only in AOE, no longer should Primal Wrath be used on single-target situations.
Rip sadly has to be used again, but Rip damage is also not as strong as it should be. Each tick for me at 70 is barely doing around 5k, whereas Shred is doing about 14-15k crits, again very low compared to let’s say, other classes. I’ve seen Fury Warriors and Demon Hunters with their main filler ability hit for 25-35k crits.
As for FB, this hits like a truck and works well with AOE now too but Apex Predator which is a talent I mentioned in my last reply, sucks on a single target, it never procs. It procs well on AOE situations, maybe getting 2 per AOE pull, but in single target situations maybe once a minute. This is something Blizzard needs to tune.
As for Veinripper vs Rip & Tear, so this is weird but this is a double talent. Rip & Tear is already baked into Primal Wrath already. So this talent is not good, and it’s better to choose Veinripper which then works better with Circle of Life and Death which increases the speed of your DoTs. Very confusing and a really bad class design honestly.
I plan on fixing the AOE macro to include FB now, I will have to look into re-working the rotation slightly to make it feel better. Similar to a single target, with how weak Primal Wrath and Rip are now, it’s better to use FB as your main finisher but also include rip on those targets too.
As I said, the DPS overall of Kitty Druids is rather low compared to other classes and this requires Blizzard to do some tuning in our favor.
I’m really liking the build, I just got to 70 yesterday and now I’m ilvl 342 doin some M0 with friends. The
AOE macro works well, but I find myself manually spamming my thrash and my charges of brutal slash. The only concern I have is with taking apex means we have to wait on a “free” FB for it to be useful, other than that it’s back to the original concept. I don’t know how adding it to AOE that fires in the rotation will help when we only take it because it’s free. if not we cripple the energy and take away from shred casts.
what id like to see is a Full ST FB raid build. I think that would hit like a damn train
i don’t mean to be offensive, it’s just my opinion. I love the macros!!
Hi @kuso
I agree and I think I did just that. I’ve updated the macro above, but I just made a minor change to a single target to perform it better.
Right now Apex isn’t worth it while I like the concept it just isn’t worth the position. This should have been put a lot higher on the tree, not a capstone. What you want to do (which is updated in the macro too), is to use FB in the macro after a Primal Wrath that way you “spread cleave” the FB.
i was freestyling on a FB-centered build that would avoid primal wrath and take all of the free fb damage toward the bottom of the tree, what do you think?
taste for blood gives 4%
relentless predator is 20% less energy cost for FB
lions strength is 15% VS blood talon gives 25% if used in the correct way
if we use a round number like 10k base damage, we wolud be adding 19% more damage base, not crits would bring the base damage up to 11.9k base
For a single target, it might be worth it, for AOE it won’t be. Thrash and Swipe (Brutal Slash) just don’t do enough without Primal Wrath.
This is a similar problem that Warlocks of all specs are dealing with too, basically making a decision on the style, single target, or AOE. I play M+ mainly so for me, AOE works best, but for raids, a single target will perform better.
In my latest run, I did 25k to the final boss, and about 40k sustained AOE at 320 item level. Though I was 3rd on DPS, compared to the BM Hunter in the group who was doing 98k DPS.
you did this dmg using the ST macro and the AOE that were just updated? hell yes!! my rogue buddies and dh buddies are smoking me in mythic 0s but hopefully this will make up for it
Yep - I just did an instance showed a screenshot too of an AOE one too. My damage is much better than it was before, and it’s because of removing certain elements. I’m finding Brutal Slash while great for AOE is terrible for a single target and actually makes your DPS lower because it uses energy. Also “Wild Slashes” talent, doesn’t bug out stealth like Brutal Slash does.
I agree, there are a few specs that are set up where you are AoE or ST. Warlock and feral are two of the bad ones, as is shadow priest and a few others. I think they were trying to let you adjust your toon from being raid focused to mythic focused. But did not give a good balance, you are either st or AoE focused and are handicapped in the other.
Right now Feral is a lot better in AOE, single target not so much. The rotation feels clunky too and needs work. Brutal Slash being an AOE first type spell really doesn’t fit into a single target rotation similar to Thrash back in the day but Thrash back in the day (Legion) was used as a filler to smooth out the rotation similar to Whirlwind for Fury Warriors, not for actual DPS. That might need to be done here for single target, without hurting energy too.
While DF has been out for a week now, it seems like certain classes on Reddit and others are getting a lot of opinions. Feral is one of them. The biggest information is the clunky rotation, and how Brutal Slash now works.
AOE has a very simple and rewarding rotation, while Single Target does not. Also because of the high energy cost of Shred, and FB it’s very hard to make this in a way that is simple for most people. To note, Feral Druids have been one of the hardest classes to play, same with Rogues because of energy. Now Rogues have this issue solved, because they now have 200 energy, instead of 100 like Feral Druids.
The only way to fix Feral honestly is from Blizzard not from us. The class is very strong and does very good damage in certain situations, but the “bleed” way of life of Feral is an afterthought. Similar to Assin Rogues, the spec just doesn’t have enough to make it more than just about bleeds.
The macro 95% is working, and will hit the Simcraft at 88-92% depending on the fight, but if we want this to be better, it will have to come from the top.
If you haven’t tried it yet, go try Outlaw and see the huge difference between Outlaw versus Feral. Outlaw does more damage, has more energy, and has more ways to generate combo points and then some. Feral I feel Blizzard didn’t really know how to make this unique when Outlaw already does all of this and is better at it.
Boomkins are in the same boat, while they were top DPS in Shadowlands, the new spells and the talent tweak were a disservice.
@Moonsorow , Heyo! Firstly, thanks so much for the hard work and the detailed explanations. Secondly, I have a follow up question about the macros; what is the purpose of making the ingame macros and why are they separate from the GSE import?
Certain spells that need a longer timer, are best put on another button. Also in many cases, if Shift, Alt, or Ctrl are already being used for other actions you need a separate button. I also try not to put any modifiers to CTRL, as it’s harder for me to reach compared to shift.
Talent codes appear to be not working. “Enter valid loadout code”
I’m not even intelligent enough to get the codes from wowhead to import without the same error.
omfg… just have to name it. /facepalm
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Go to WoWHead > Guides > Feral Druid > Bee’s Mythic+
They provided a screenshot and a calculated of it too.
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So I’ve been reading the replies but I’m a bit confused. What talent setup are we suggested to run with the current version of the macros?
To explain this as clearly as I can.
If you run Bee’s setup, you will be building a DoT build which is very good for M+ and raids that push AOE damage. But if you want to do more single-target damage, there is another build that sacrifices Brutal Slash and puts into Bloodtalons to quickly ramp up the Shred and Rip damage.
This is going to be your choice, and I’ll provide both talent sets and macros when I’m finished but this is the issue with Feral Druids across the board right now.
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Hi,
Can you post screenshots of both builds and talents ?
Bees link is not available anymore
Thanks